The "doing" of "awakening": Atman Vichara

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Tobias

The "doing" of "awakening": Atman Vichara

Beitrag von Tobias »

The "doing" of "awakening": Atman Vichara

(part1)

If I look to the normal experience of myself, as this living being, I experience
myself in two aspects. One is my life, always moving, changing, longing for pleasure,
trying to find ways to avoid pain and suffering - and this other aspect is the still presence of
myself, wherein my life happens.

Somehow we are educated to put our attention mainly to the things changing in life, because
they are promising pleasure or seem the cause for problems arising. And what changes
asks for attention, normally for all attention.

In the "vichara" (or however one likes to call this), I found it helpful to put my attention
to the aspect of this simple experience "to be" , just "to be", and examine this sensation, just by
feeling it consciously, what means "to give this experience (my) attention."

"What is this?" ... "What is this, my sensation "to be"?"

And examining this sensation, it did show, that it was always the same. And this experience
"to be" was always with any experience arising and going.

What this myself is, what has this sensation "to be", I don't know, I can't explain, because it
has no shape I could get hold on. It is only "to be", not moving, not going, not coming ...
the background in which coming and going of the experiences of life happen.

And this is the experience, in which I am always myself, independent of all comings and goings,
and that is not object to the comings and goings in life. It is the subject.

With any experience, one remembers, was this experience "to be", this simple experience everyone
knows. And it is always here.

I looked closer (it just takes time, weeks, months in returning again and again with ones own
attention to this experience) and saw, that it was always here. This experience itself, and the
so called "here" are identical.

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

(part2)

The fascinating understanding, that did arise for me in the close look into/onto
this (my) simple experience "to be" was, that in this experience I felt closer to myself,
than in any experience coming and going in the happening of life.

It is like a: "Just stand still, and you are at home". It is something, I can reach simply
in doing nothing. An experience, to what I felt back, equal how far my imagination
went away into the past or future.

There is something, I consist of, that must not be kept alive - that is just alive out of itself - and
doesn't ask for any struggle or effort to be ... it just exists out of itself. I exist in this
experience out of myself, effortless.

To be something in life means always to struggle, and to keep it running, it asks for effort,
earning money, cleaning up, fitting it, and all this stuff. But this experience exists without any
struggle, can't be destroyed - nor be reached. It always exists.

And this simple experience, everyone knows, but mostly is neglected, is what in the
spiritual arena is called "the awakened state".

And the funny thing is, that everyone knows this experience, no one can avoid it at no point -
it can only be neglected, what means, it seems to have "nothing to say", because it is deeply
known, very intimate.

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

(part3)

To rest in my own experience "to be" is not at all a real effort, because "to be" is on itself effortless,
and so one can just rest in it - or relax into it.

But in the beginning it is an effort, it appears to be difficult, to rest with my own attention in
the experience "to be". Why? Because I am used to look to the things happening around me,
and all this things catch my attention again and again. So it seems to be a struggle, and one has really to
force oneself in the beginning - because it is a shift in attention - and attention goes to, where it
is used to. It is a habit.

It becomes more and more easy, if with a sudden there come some sort of "glimpses", as
little insides about the "hereness". But this is up to ones own personality, I came to see, how
they look like. And one can also discuss, if one should speak about them, because they are
all also interpretation about what our reality is. No truth, just an "expanded" understanding,
a try to integrate something like "formlessness" in ones own personality.

One has to see, that the "awakened state" always existed. It is this integration of this
"other reality" about oneself into the own personality, that makes the difference. Self-understanding
changes. The answer to the "who I am"? changes.

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

(part4)

I think it was Nisargadatta, who called the own experience "to be": "I am", and wrote
three books about it, but always with the simple advice of his Guru in background: "rest in the "I am"".

And his whole advice about "what could be done" is "rest in the "I am" (as often as possible for you)".

The complication in the "vichara" is not, that the "vichara" itself would be complicated. Everyone knows this
"I am", and can rest in it. The complication is, that one struggles with the question, if
one does it right or wrong. The miracle is, that no one can do it wrong - but in the beginning
one is unable to see this.

And this is the whole problem with the "vichara". I have to do it in the beginning without any
idea about, if I do it "right" or "wrong". This understanding will come, but it can take several months.

And there is a permanent "deepening" in the "vichara", that seems not to end, later on, when it
unfolds in the own experience. And in this "deepening" of the "vichara" there is also personal change in
speaking about it.

With the "vichara" unfolds also something, one calls the "not-knowing". The "not-knowing" is also
something not really new. No one knows, what this life is. Humanity is in speculation about itself,
life. But what life is, no one knows. It is not like this, one would not know this, one just doesn't
want to see it, and holds to anything, that seems to give hold to this oneself, one believes to be.

It seems to me more like this, that if one finds this "not changing oneself", there isn't any longer
the emotional need, to hold to something like "a truth about this life".

In this aspect "to be" one is just never lost, equal how life goes on and what it gives and what it takes.
This rests still pleasant or unpleasant, but it takes nothing from me, in this fundamental self-experience
"to be".

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Edgar
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Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Edgar »

English speaking corner


geil ! (ich mein: cool. äh. ne. "i mean: cool". jetzt passts. äh, no, "now its fitting"). short version:

Cool ! :supercool:

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

(part5 and end)

And there are plenty of advantages with the "vichara".

It is totally free of cost, because "to be" no one can give to me or take from me.
It is my own rock bottom experience.

It is always available, in any situation. In any situation "I am", otherwise it would
not be a part of *my* (I am) experience.

It is without any requirement. Requirements appear as ideas in my experience "to be",
but don't condition this experience. It is always at the bottom and with any experience.

One can do this, wherever one wants, feels like, equal how the situation looks like,
because my presence ("to be") is always the "background" of any of my experiences.

This simplicity is what seems to be difficult, because one is used in life to reach anything
with struggle. "To be" is already, always, whenever I turn my conscious attention to it,
I see it.

It is in a much closer sense myself, than all the things coming and going in life.
"I am", I am the subject to my life - that, for "whom" or "what" it is.

But the biggest advantage is, that the "vichara" creates peace with myself, beside
all its easiness.

Would it be a little more difficult, it would be much easier to speak about
the "vichara". Would it at least be as difficult, as to turn a paper, one could say: turn the paper.

But the "vichara" is much easier than that. It is so easy, that it requires no real deed,
just only to turn my attention to my own experience "to be", to myself.

(End of: The "doing" of "awakening": atman vichara)

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

Edgar hat geschrieben:
English speaking corner


geil ! (ich mein: cool. äh. ne. "i mean: cool". jetzt passts. äh, no, "now its fitting"). short version:

Cool ! :supercool:


Vielleicht könnte man sogar eine eigene Englisch-Rubrik machen? Vielleicht verirrt sich ja mal
ein Ausländer hierher? :tobroll: :icon_wink_small:

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Edgar
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Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Edgar »

Tobias hat geschrieben:
Edgar hat geschrieben:
English speaking corner


geil ! (ich mein: cool. äh. ne. "i mean: cool". jetzt passts. äh, no, "now its fitting"). short version:

Cool ! :supercool:


Vielleicht könnte man sogar eine eigene Englisch-Rubrik machen? Vielleicht verirrt sich ja mal
ein Ausländer hierher? :tobroll: :icon_wink_small:


ja, find ich ne gute Idee... - ich notiers einmal... ;-)

Vera

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Vera »

Tobias hat geschrieben:
Vielleicht könnte man sogar eine eigene Englisch-Rubrik machen? Vielleicht verirrt sich ja mal
ein Ausländer hierher? :tobroll: :icon_wink_small:


Thats a very good idea!

"Erwachen goes international" :thumbup: :icon_mrgreen_small:

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nano
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Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von nano »

Yeah, the idea is really good, but you should easier explain it, then Americans could also understand it. ;-)

(my native language calls love) <3
"Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist. "
Wittgenstein

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

nano hat geschrieben:Yeah, the idea is really good, but you should easier explain it, then Americans could also understand it. ;-)



You are this garstig today, nano? :icon_mrgreen_small: An easier way to explain?

The simple truth is, that you never change whatever happens.

Till the life is over, there is life. Now one knows from where it came, I came - and where
I go. You are a passenger in a journey, as a part of the journey. You meet different people,
an every one has another idea, what this life might be.

But all of them appeared the same way as yourself - directly out of the "not-knowing".

If you only look to your life, you are a human, lost in life. If you look to your presence,
you recognize yourself as something not to say, but yourself. You are at home,
whatever might happen in life.

Life is a miracle. :tobroll: :icon_wink_small:

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

About consciousness

Someone asked some time ago, why I don't use the expression "consciousness" for
"presence" or the "experience to exist": "to be".

In the end all is about consciousness, but it is nothing separate from this "yourself"
you feel to be. And this "to be" -- "I am" -- is that to what the word "consciousness"
points. To your own experience to be.

All I know about consciousness is, that it exists, but there is no form to it, I could
could grasp with this miraculous consciousness. All what I can see of the pure consciousness
is "to be" ... the I-am-ness of consciousness.

And the big miracle of pure consciousness is, that it has no form. All what appears
as a form is already a creation in consciousness - Consciousness is the "creating substance",
but with any form it creates it is also the formless background in which this
creation happens.

But I can not say, what consciousness is. All what I get hold to, is already a creation
in consciousness.

But one can also claim: any form, any sensation, all is consciousness.

Consciousness exists in two aspects: the form an the formless background.

And in the same way I exist in life: as the form and her formless background.

Tobias

Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Tobias »

To me the pure consciousness feels like an "existing nothingness". And this is the miracle of
consciousness. It can exit without any expression of form, but exists - and stays in this
state of "non-existence" as "the seed of creation".

This is somehow that, what the old books about consciousness try to explain, if they say, that an universe
is only like a little corn of dust, dancing in the light of consciousness. This refers to the potency of
conciousness: to be "the creator".

Consciuosness is just a word, for that, in that I am myself, but also a total miracle to myself.

"Oh my god, who I am?" It is an answer, an answer directly to feel, but who I am? To answer
this question as a form, as a quality that is to all, I can only say: I am, what points to
the aspect in that I am the background to all.

But in life, I am only the form consciousness gave me, and I have no idea, out of what
reasons I have this form. This is, where consciousness rules above its creation.

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Edgar
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Re: English speaking corner

Beitrag von Edgar »

Edgar hat geschrieben:
Tobias hat geschrieben:Vielleicht könnte man sogar eine eigene Englisch-Rubrik machen? Vielleicht verirrt sich ja mal
ein Ausländer hierher? :tobroll: :icon_wink_small:


ja, find ich ne gute Idee... - ich notiers einmal... ;-)


*made it* ;-)

(and i already moved the thread into this new sub-forum... ;-) )

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